Roy Jerden
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In Defense of Critique

Blog Posted by Roy Jerden: 2/22/2016 3:21:00 PM

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Date: 2/28/2016 6:43:00 PM
I like the fact that they will remove someone for abuse after the 1st warning. People need to remember that a poetry site is for learning and enjoyment; not petty arguments and egos :)
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Date: 2/23/2016 8:09:00 PM
"What We Consider Previous Publication: Previous publication is considered to be any appearance in print or online, including on or in a newspaper, newsletter, magazine, anthology, chapbook, book, website, electronic magazine, personal blog, Twitter, Facebook, or other social-media platform. Please note that even if the print run or circulation of the print publication where the work has previously appeared is small, this is still considered previous publication. No work that has been excerpted elsewhere is eligible for submission; nor is a work that has been revised since its original publication" This from the Malahat Review (akin to your Paris Review, biggest of the big boys)
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Cyndi Macmillan
Date: 2/25/2016 5:48:00 AM
It was hard enough to remove about 900 I think. I should purge more of them. I am more sentimental about their connection to different poets on Soup then I am about the poem, itself. Gotta fly.
Jerden Avatar
Roy Jerden
Date: 2/24/2016 8:24:00 PM
You have a huge number posted. I try to keep mine trimmed to about 50, mostly my favs and the most recent ones. I keep the others backed up. In fact, I need to do some purging.
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Cyndi Macmillan
Date: 2/24/2016 1:55:00 PM
I'm one of those annoying people who follows rules. I haven't even tampered with one of my previously posted Soup poems (and I got 1000 of them.) Stupid? Probably. So I consider 1,000 poems as good practice. LOL! Yes, email is excluded as it is considered a "writers group" and those are allowed.
Jerden Avatar
Roy Jerden
Date: 2/23/2016 8:19:00 PM
Pretty strict. I presume e-mail is excluded? Really, in the end, it's all about not getting caught, isn't it? You know, even your online backup files like Dropbox might be considered by the poetry cops.
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Cyndi Macmillan
Date: 2/23/2016 8:12:00 PM
This is pretty standard. Some smaller journals, tend to be a bit more lenient. Man, I am beat tonight. Goodnight, Roy. :)
Date: 2/23/2016 6:00:00 PM
Great Blog, Roy. I found the site's guidelines etc to be hilarious. There is a whole world of poetry outside of Soup and it is good to "play the field." I checked out 'the forum'here on Soup... what a JOKE. Can't stand its format. I'm at the point that it would be self-defeating to post my poetry at any site as that would be deemed published. I have been requested to send my work to some journals by the editors. I am 'almost' there, but need to tinker a wee bit more... workworkwork :D
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Cyndi Macmillan
Date: 2/23/2016 8:08:00 PM
Well, every journal I submit to says they will not accept poetry that has been anywhere on the net, even a personal blog or facebook. Hold on...
Jerden Avatar
Roy Jerden
Date: 2/23/2016 6:10:00 PM
Also, I use a pseudonym there, although the admin has my contact info.
Jerden Avatar
Roy Jerden
Date: 2/23/2016 6:08:00 PM
Actually, the site is ideally used for poems in progress, to get feedback early on, so it is better when actually published. I was actually rebuked by a moderator for posting a PS poem, she thought it was too good, I guess and googled it. I was just testing the waters. But it shows you they are sharp. I don't know how a publisher would feel about this. It's a good question.
Date: 2/23/2016 4:48:00 PM
Well Roy it didn't take long to see there's a lot of learning to do to be a critique. Fortunately there's a lot of great information available to move me in the right direction. Just reading the comments on others work has filled in some spaces in my thinking. Thanks for the link.
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Roy Jerden
Date: 2/23/2016 4:57:00 PM
Thanks, Robert. That's really what it's all about - learning. A critique is not perforce negative. It's a review of what the poem is trying to say, and the way it says it. There are both technical and artistic components. Clearly part of artistry is ineffable, though and cannot be analyzed. Appreciate the comments.
Date: 2/22/2016 7:48:00 PM
Way too long & too much to absorb! Folks here cringe if you ask them nicely tp put a period after a line with a subject & a verb in it [really!] PS I know you mean well but you haven't tried any of my suggested 'growth experiences Roy?'
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Jerden Avatar
Roy Jerden
Date: 2/22/2016 8:19:00 PM
Point taken. I shortened it by removing some of the admin stuff. I presume PS denotes post scriptum rather than poetry soup, so I'll take the remark as directed at me. I find good, even harsh critique serves me better than mentoring as a learning style. I actually enjoy it, as long as it refers to the work. One that I really like uses the Socratic method, just posing questions. Yes, sometimes it hurts, but no pain, no gain.
Date: 2/22/2016 3:39:00 PM
This whole critique/blog thing puts me in mind of an old Monty Python routine about "The Funniest Joke Ever Told". Perhaps if we can all agree on what the BEST poem ever written is we can all stop writing and shred everything but that one PERFECT POEM....
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Robert Lindley
Date: 2/23/2016 9:51:00 AM
So true Roy. Let an artist take a picture of a wooded scene, the that same artist stand there and paint the same wooded scene as he looks directly at it in person. The picture(anybody could have taken) will not bring him fame but yet the painting may one day do just that!
Jerden Avatar
Roy Jerden
Date: 2/22/2016 4:34:00 PM
Ah, but it's the imperfections we love isn't it. Painting did not cease to exist after photography was invented, did it?

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