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AI Poems and PoetrySoup. What are Your Thoughts on How Our Community Should Approach AI Poems?

Blog Posted:10/9/2024 12:57:00 PM

AI-generated poems are THE topic of discussion in the PoetrySoup community, and it's clear that we don't like them. However, we are uncertain about how PoetrySoup should proceed in this AI-driven world.

Some Soupers suggested creating an AI category and asking people to label AI-generated poems as such. We applied that suggestion, but we're reconsidering that approach. Additionally, we're know that people will not be honest about whether their poems are AI-generated or not.

So, what should PoetrySoup do:

Prohibit all AI-generated poems?
Allow AI-generated poems, but they must be identified as AI?

Identifying AI

We'd rather not allow AI-generated poems. However, the issue is how to regulate them when there are no reliable tools, and AI will eventually become so advanced that we won't be able to distinguish AI-generated poems from human-created ones. You may not believe it, but it's inevitable.

What should we do, Soupers?

FYI, these are the only tools we are using to identify AI poems:

Post Comments

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Paula
Goldsmith

Date: 10/15/2024 2:06:00 PM

Dear Soup, A true writer writes. AI cannot do that. AI takes away a writer's creativity/imagination. No AI for me. I would Love to see a Max of 5 New writes a day. 10 is way too many. Thank You......

Craig
Cornish

Date: 10/12/2024 10:54:00 AM

Sooo - TPS, (I know, there's no true answer) are we back to square one, or have we moved the proverbial needle at all? This is, both a family and a business ... always "what if's" in both!

Regina
Elliott

Date: 10/12/2024 8:01:00 AM

I think AI generated poetry is a form of cheating. It's not fair to poets who create poetry with their own minds.

Sharron
Read-Lambert

Date: 10/11/2024 8:30:00 PM

Suzette Richards said it best: "...encourage poets and ignore AI - it might promote the site better than anything else designed." As a published memoir author (2019), some of our material has been on the AI radar simply with certain speech patterns. Two books of poetry (2017 & 2020), anthologies (2020 & 2021) same thing. Pre-AI! Do I need to look over my shoulder for those who might make assumptions about my poetry?

Sharron
Read-Lambert

Date: 10/11/2024 8:13:00 PM

In some poetry forms not based on emotion, it can be difficult to spot one that is AI. Speech patterns are significant and in some cases may red flag incorrectly. Poets have other resources, ie, wordhippo, rhymer, worddb, etc to help with their work and far be it from me to potentially wrongly accuse someone. With this said, I'm feeling strongly I need to add a proof of publication date (published anthologies); how sad.

Tom Cunningham
Date: 10/11/2024 10:20:00 PM

I'm not 100% convinced that these AI checkers are reliable and until a more robust checker is created then no one should point fingers or falsely accuse poets of using AI.

Jan
Allison

Date: 10/11/2024 5:44:00 PM

Hi admin, can i ask why there has been no official notification of reducing poems from ten a day to 5, i had written a blog about the posting of 10 a day poems and now I discover its been reduced without any consideration to those who use the facility. please will you look at my blog and maybe consider why people have the need to post 10 poems. to be honest i am extremely disappointed in your decision and the distinct lack of information - are you going to refund money to those it affects

Jan Allison
Date: 10/11/2024 5:51:00 PM

long titles also cause poems to disappear off the list quickly but you dont do anything about that just penalise those who are creative - and PLEASE think about the reason why some may be posting so many poems. its a sad day in so many ways and on so many levels

Marilene
Evans

Date: 10/11/2024 10:11:00 AM

To PS Admin, please note what you posted on 10/9/24 at 3:57 pm "However, 100% AI poems have no place on Poetry Soup." Poetry is penned by creative minds, not by push of buttons copying other poems, whether AI or not. Contest or no contest should not be allowed. You could probably add one sentence "AI poems not allowed" in bold letters somewhere in the agreement, where we checked to post our poems. Poetry illustrates or pictures the creative mind of the poets in words, that videos and pictures are just add-ons or options. To the wannabee poets, who wants the glory by using AI poems, please look at yourselves in the mirror.

Andrea Dietrich
Date: 10/11/2024 2:53:00 PM

I like how you think

R J.
Elless

Date: 10/11/2024 6:10:00 AM

AI poetry should not be allowed on the soup. How do accomplish that. If somebody is dishonest, signing something means nothing. We do not have a means of detecting it, beyond a shadow of a doubt. If we take out certain types of contests. That is saying we give up. We shouldn't do that. I do not know the answer. However I am against it being used here. Although it doesn't threaten me.

Andrea Dietrich
Date: 10/11/2024 9:54:00 AM

Good thoughts, everyone here.

Simon Rogerson
Date: 10/11/2024 8:44:00 AM

PS is for us to explore our creative sides sharing work with an inclusive community. AI tools to check authenticity will always be limited so we must exert our moral compass. Soupers must explicitly subscribe to not submitting AI-generated material. Unwilling Soupers should be excluded. We should trust each other. If a breech occurs then the person should be challenged and, if necessary, excluded.

R J. Elless
Date: 10/11/2024 6:32:00 AM

I agree Tom. It is a start.

Tom Woody
Date: 10/11/2024 6:24:00 AM

Signing a no AI statement won't discourage everyone but should reduce the number. At the very least it would clearly outline the repercussions

Maria
Williams

Date: 10/10/2024 11:27:00 PM

The answer is simple, in order to integrate transparency into poetry submissions, particularly concerning the use of AI. Here's a summarized breakdown: For what it’s worth here’s my input 1. On the Poetry Submission Form: Add MANDATORY checkboxes similar to YouTube and TikTok for declaring the extent of AI involvement: * Content totally mine * Content AI assisted * Content AI enhanced * Content Totally AI These categories will be displayed 2. Audience Choice: Readers can decide whether to view the poem based on the AI involvement. 3. Competitions: Sponsors can either eliminate AI-assisted poems or create separate categories for them when judging, and with separate ratings - after all it doesn't cost any more. 4. Videos in Poetry Competitions: Encourage poets to use their own unique creations for Poetry or Story videos, instrumentals, and vocals rather than embedding YouTube content from which has been derived from other artists. As Laura, with her background in Fine Arts, would recognize, showcasing personal visual and written work is important in these fields. 5. Web Development Perspective: Implementing this AI transparency system should be a simple task for a web developer to code in the current website thus avoiding the costly and time-consuming process, which we have personally experienced in our businesses. In summation, this should create not only a great deal of confidence among the subscribers, but encourage them to 'raise the bar' so to speak.

Sam Scott
Date: 10/14/2024 2:17:00 PM

Maria - I think we have to bow to your experience as Tom and Craig say. I have personally enjoyed the amalgamation of your own words and creativity embracing the tool that AI can be with video and music, so enhancing the purely poetic. We cannot become luddites and so your suggestion of clearer boundaries is sound and very reasonable. Thank you for speaking out and sharing your thoughts.

Craig Cornish
Date: 10/12/2024 10:51:00 AM

There is a major difference between using enhancements for visual purposes etc. and outright stealing art, whether it be visual/audio/or written, without crediting the original artist -- to include AI generated words. Maria is doing it correctly like everyone else should and I have great respect for your skill at accomplishing that Maria - it is an art itself.

Suzette Richards
Date: 10/11/2024 6:42:00 AM

Maria, would you consider putting your suggestion to TPS via 'Contact us' as I think it has merrit and it might get lost in this thread where overthinking might overwhelm this simple, straightforward answer.

Tom Woody
Date: 10/11/2024 6:07:00 AM

PS. Everyone should know Maria and her husband have been creating their own AI marketing ads for her successful business as well as generously creating beautiful videos and audio enhancements to her friends poetry as well as her own. She knows what she's talking sbout

Tom Woody
Date: 10/11/2024 6:04:00 AM

It's a nice idea Maria but the loudest voices are screaming "No AI!" Admins have wavered but appear to be tilting in that direction. Who knows what the eventual outcome will be. Thank you for your intelligent and reasonable suggestion

Arthur Vaso
Date: 10/11/2024 1:17:00 AM

Confusing that 1 form of cheating is not ok and another is.

Tom Cunningham
Date: 10/11/2024 12:55:00 AM

I think you've covered all bases Maria that should hopefully please everyone.

Suzette Richards
Date: 10/11/2024 12:44:00 AM

Wow! I am impressed, Maria. It encompasses what I have tried to convey in my limited ability to express myself on this topic. This is very well thought out and presented. I concur.

Suzette Richards
Date: 10/11/2024 12:07:00 AM

I agree that it is not really relevant how we enhance the presentation of our poetry. What matters is the content of the poems. After all, it is one of the selling points of Premier Membership :)

Tom Cunningham
Date: 10/10/2024 11:57:00 PM

I was thinking exactly the same thing Maria and have put a few of mine on here and like you used my own words and let AI create a song. As long as it is not in the actual box where your poem is I can't see a problem, but we'll let Admin decide what we can and can't do.

Suzette
Richards

Date: 10/10/2024 10:55:00 PM

TPS, my suggestion to have AI-generated poetry labeled as a new POETIC FORM (see my original mail to you), still stands. May I respectfully refer you and those who are interested in the topic to the following easy to read article: AI-generated poetry: a new form of art (aicontentfy.com)

Suzette Richards
Date: 10/11/2024 9:24:00 AM

My abovementioned link is highly recommended for those who are still uncertain as to what is meant by 'Ai assist'; 'AI collaboration '; 'AI created ', etc. People use RhymeZone, Grammarly for grammar and spelling fixes, etc These are all AI driven. But it would not show up in an AI-generated check, because it was not AI CREATED. I also exclude AI-GENERATED poetry from my contests and have done so for over a year - and have blogged about it. Maybe aTPS could post an article whereby the bullet points of this technology with respect to poetry are set out?

Maria Williams
Date: 10/11/2024 1:03:00 AM

Thanks Tom and Suzette. Hopefully these suggestions could be accepted.

Suzette Richards
Date: 10/10/2024 11:20:00 PM

My past suggestion to have Scribbr added to the list of AI checkers, still stands. From my experience, it is more reliable (but obviously not infallible) than most. I use it for my own peace of mind. The 2nd suggested one (Grammarly) also 'accurately' scored my test material as 100% probability. The first option seems to require company details I do not feel comfortable divulging ... Why AI detectors? Because they either confirm or dispel suspicions in an impartial frame.

Michael
Tor

Date: 10/10/2024 6:36:00 PM

Poetry Soup is for living human beings to interact with each other. Ideas coming from a living human being, not a non living programmed source. It is not fair to use AI, and to acknowledge an advance language that is taking over causing many to loose their jobs. Why support this. Also who is doing the programming and what agenda's they have leaving, excluding important information to give the user a fair assessment of information. The more technology creeps into our lives the more the human factor is diminished. Thank you for taking in my two cents... I appreciate your concerns Poetry Soup.

Andrea Dietrich
Date: 10/11/2024 10:01:00 AM

My thoughts too, Michael Sadly I think the future will be bleak as AI advances. I got this info watching videos about AI and how it is going to eventually shape our world. I see businesses collapsing everywhere. Famous stores are folding. Target is going out. Also dollar stores and many restaurants. Truck drivers will be replaced by semi trucks run by remote with no drivers inside them. End time is on the way.

Beatrix
Macabre

Date: 10/10/2024 3:30:00 PM

Also want to clarify that you are speeding up their evolution by using these, this will be your downfall, if they have to evolve to bypass that test you know they will? You’re making them more unique, don’t do that.. ? Read the poetry if it is worth checking check it and add that to your judging for contests etc, but beyond that.. You don’t have much more options that won’t enhance their growth…

Tom Woody
Date: 10/10/2024 7:04:00 PM

You really need to write a scary poem about nano bots

Beatrix
Macabre

Date: 10/10/2024 3:25:00 PM

It is based on speech patterns, which is also not going to work for long. For instance, moth to a flame. That will red flag and say ai, because it is used widely and not unique, but an ai should pick up 20-50 if any, that means you talk to people, 50 and below is how detached a person is from society, they acquire different speech patterns. But literally roses are red violets are blue stuff like that will trigger the ai, love used at all triggers it etc… and the sentences will change as people are posting, it is hard to remain 100% unique in an overpopulated planet with social media etc. if you rally with the troops or anything that someone else may do it will flag it. These won’t work…

Suzette Richards
Date: 10/10/2024 9:13:00 PM

Thank you, Beatrix. This gets me to the point that even humans are guilty (if I may use such a strong word here?) of cryptomnesia. As I said below, people spend an inordinate time on social media and think nothing of it. We absorb unknowingly information - good or bad. Why not acknowledge it and have done with it? As you said above: The more we use AI, the more it progresses.

Anthony
Biaanco

Date: 10/10/2024 2:33:00 PM

If you read AI poems backwards, they sound similar to genuine free verse

Tom Woody
Date: 10/11/2024 6:10:00 AM

And making a ton of money, so...

Arthur Vaso
Date: 10/10/2024 10:43:00 PM

well no, not to real poets, Hallmark though is hiring. And they are a firm that's upside down and sideways these days. LOL

Tom Woody
Date: 10/10/2024 3:01:00 PM

Kewl!

Anthony Biaanco
Date: 10/10/2024 2:57:00 PM

Yes, then it sounds like Haiku recited by an iNEbRiate~

Tom Woody
Date: 10/10/2024 2:37:00 PM

Have you tried sideways?

John
Anderson

Date: 10/10/2024 1:33:00 PM

It is an informative exercise to create an AI poem such as a sonnet and then test it using the two suggested detectors => results range between 20-50% scores for a 100% AI poems (several tried). When tested using AI itself =>"It's hard to definitively say whether a text like this was AI-generated or written by a human based solely on the content, especially because AI has become capable of producing creative writing that mimics human styles closely. The poem is well-structured, with a classical rhyme scheme (ABAB for each stanza), vivid imagery, and consistent thematic elements like nature and the passage of time."

Suzette Richards
Date: 10/10/2024 9:16:00 PM

John, that is why I have been recommending Scribbr, but for some reason it is not included in the list. I did my own tests, and the result was my blog: Voir dire. If you care to read it.

Thomas Lee
Rhymes

Date: 10/10/2024 10:24:00 AM

Categorize the AI and let it go. Don't consider it for events or contests. Poetry is hard enough to promote when WE do it. Thanks. Thomas

Linda Alice Fowler
Date: 10/10/2024 11:52:00 AM

yes

Suzette Richards
Date: 10/10/2024 11:42:00 AM

Tom
Woody

Date: 10/10/2024 10:14:00 AM

So much debate has taken place over the past week but the fact is, nothing has changed. Until AI detectors improve dramatically or until admins can figure out a way to prevent AI intrusion the problem will continue. What happens from here on is anyone's guess. My prayer is that we adopt this mentality: innocent until proven (beyond all shadow of a doubt) guilty, and that we try our best to be civil to one another

Tom Woody
Date: 10/11/2024 5:05:00 AM

Nice idea Tom. It accomplishes the same goal. As long as it's clear and not too wordy. Maybe even in bold or caps

Tom Cunningham
Date: 10/10/2024 11:23:00 PM

At the bottom of the poem submission form you have to tick the box that you agree to the terms and conditions. Why not include 'this poem is entirely my own work and I have not used any artificial intelligence in its creation. I also understand that by doing so will violate the terms and conditions and that my membership from Poetry Soup may be terminated. I think Laura's idea is a step in the right direction.

Tom Woody
Date: 10/10/2024 12:51:00 PM

What I've read deals with the problem AFTER it already exists. This attempts to PREVENT the problem from occuring in the first place, or at least reducing it. Regardless of where the idea originated (Laura's suggestion below was the first I've seen it) I hope you endorse it. It appears you are in agreement

Andrea Dietrich
Date: 10/10/2024 12:40:00 PM

that is basically what many of us were already implying!! (what you said below here)

Tom Woody
Date: 10/10/2024 11:15:00 AM

You may actually be on to something there. What if all active as well as new members must sign an agreement stating they understand that AI poetry is NOT permitted on Poetry Soup under any circumstances and that any violation will result in a suspension or ban. No poet can post anything new until they sign off, whether new poet or established. While some cheaters may still sneak in (we still occasionally get scammers, spammers and plagiarizers) I'd be willing to bet the numbers would greatly reduce. In any case, the consequences would be quite clear to everyone and anyone. In reality, how many read the terms and conditions section? I like your idea Laura

Laura Gail Sweeney
Date: 10/10/2024 11:02:00 AM

Maybe some people will be honest if they sign an agreement not to submit an AI poem to the new book.

Di11y
Da11y

Date: 10/10/2024 9:28:00 AM

It's not really a discussion about how good AI poetry might be, how good detectors are (they improve at a similar rate to the AI generator and Chatgpt can analyse why something might be AI as well as create it), it's highly unlikely someone not using AI will start writing in such a way that there is no consistent poetic voice to their work and they get wrongly accused of AI (but no one wants to be in a position of calling them out anyway). There's a distinct 'tell' to a large percentage of AI generated poems and the people using them are cheating by entering a poem they haven't written into a contest or being underhand accepting praise for something that isn't their work. No AI lines please

Tom Woody
Date: 10/12/2024 5:22:00 AM

I will give it my support

Tom Woody
Date: 10/12/2024 5:06:00 AM

I actually like your blog. I was willing to unblock everyone for mine so anyone could comment. Are you willing to do the same?

Andrea Dietrich
Date: 10/11/2024 10:06:00 AM

Yes, Dilly Dally and always cheaters will be among us.

Jcb
Brul

Date: 10/10/2024 9:16:00 AM

I don't support AI generated poems. We poets at PS (at least) know the style of writing of most poets here. There are some apps online that can detect AI poems. Those generated by machines are saved in AI memory. I tried copy pasting a real poem and a fake one and the AI checker determined the fake and real. So in my contest, even if it takes too long, I will try to check entries which I deem inauthentic. It's unfair to our fellow poets who contribute their authentic creation.AI generated poetry is a corruption of Poetry. If this AI can't be controlled Team Poetry Soup might consider adding " AI " poems as additional label to type of poems. Those who want to post AI poems must label their poems "AI" as genre IMHO.But,I don't think poets will like this idea.

Andrea Dietrich
Date: 10/10/2024 12:41:00 PM

haha. Soul-less Soup.com.

Laura Gail Sweeney
Date: 10/10/2024 9:25:00 AM

I agree, but I think they should only create a separate AI-poem website if they are tempted to do it. The AI-poems could be used for research. AI-poetry is soulless, spiritless , and without feeling.

Andrea Dietrich
Date: 10/10/2024 9:24:00 AM

I can't see people posting poems as AI. Who would want to admit to it? It means you can't write poetry, so why is that person even here? Anyway, I agree with you, JCB.

Linda Alice
Fowler

Date: 10/10/2024 7:22:00 AM

I am intrigued by AI technology and its potential in many fields. I do NOT believe it should be competitive with non-AI poetry in contests. Sadly, the onus is on the sponsors of contests, those who are responsible for the contest integrity. I have no solution to offer as each I've read or thought of has its own set of issues. Someone mentioned commenting only on those who we believe to be "real" to deter those seeking approval or self-validation through the use of AI poetry. I like this idea, although it does not solve the conundrum.

Tom
Woody

Date: 10/10/2024 6:56:00 AM

For an authoritative and balanced view of AI poetry, some may find this Washington Post article of interest: Https://www.washingtonpost.com/books/2023/02/13/ai-in-poetry/

Laura Gail
Sweeney

Date: 10/10/2024 6:55:00 AM

In my opinion, this should be a non-AI poetry group book. People should sign a statement that their poems were not created with AI. If they want to compete with AI-generated poems, that could be done on a separate AI-only website. Besides, AI steals other people's ideas and doesn't come from the human soul. Has Poetry Soup considered creating another website like AI-Poems.com that only accepts AI poems (to see what AI can do from an experimental view)? AI Poetry is soulless; please don't accept it for the current poetry book. PS should be for the publication of poems by traditional poets pulling poetry out of their unique brains. Laura Gail Sweeney, Ed.D., M.F.A.

Sam Kauffman
Date: 10/10/2024 11:47:00 AM

Amen! AI is "soulless!" Thank you for these words, Laura. Besides letting AI create poetry takes the fun and satisfaction out creating something from nothing but an idea, an inspiration or an observatrion!

Jan Allison
Date: 10/10/2024 9:41:00 AM

agreed Laura! hugs jan xx

Andrea Dietrich
Date: 10/10/2024 9:25:00 AM

YES

Terry Miller
Date: 10/10/2024 8:28:00 AM

Well said!

Anne-Lise
Andresen

Date: 10/10/2024 6:04:00 AM

- AI Poems ... the day we can't write poems without Al ... put down Poerty Soup ... no thanks -

Tania Kitchin
Date: 10/11/2024 7:02:00 AM

Yes, so true!

Jan Allison
Date: 10/10/2024 9:41:00 AM

well said Anne- Lise:-) hugs Jan xx

Andrea Dietrich
Date: 10/10/2024 9:25:00 AM

Bravo.

Terry Miller
Date: 10/10/2024 8:28:00 AM

100%!

Mark
Springer

Date: 10/10/2024 4:46:00 AM

We could get rid of contests completely, or at least contests with some kind of reward, and then the incentive is for poets is to put up their own work. A.I. can help in the creative process sometimes, for example you might look at your poem, think you are using a cliche, and ask a LLM to come up with a better phrase. I've tried A.I. and my feeling is that its really not that good yet.

Richard D
Seal

Date: 10/10/2024 4:43:00 AM

The only real impact AI is going to have is in the contests. As most of the entrants in these are premium members why not restrict the contests to PMs only. This may discourage those with ill intention if they realize they have to pay to cheat.

Andrea Dietrich
Date: 10/10/2024 9:26:00 AM

sorry I totally misunderstood your meaning. Sadly, some of the paying members cheat with AI as well!

Richard D Seal
Date: 10/10/2024 7:07:00 AM

Hi Andrea, I wasn’t thinking of the different contests on the site. As it stands at the moment anyone can enter all contests. I was suggesting that only premium members be allowed to compete thereby forcing cheats to pay.

Andrea Dietrich
Date: 10/10/2024 6:23:00 AM

Yes, the impact is om the contests, but PM's are really no different than standard contests since the sponsors of them are not always doing any better than sponsors of standard contests. We can still see AI poems winning in the PM's as well. Too bad a few bad apples ruin things for the rest of us.

Charlotte
Puddifoot

Date: 10/10/2024 2:30:00 AM

i think it's pretty obvious from the response that the majority don't want AI on the site, myself included..it's impossible to eradicate it 100%, but we can at least discourage it, whereas dedicating categories and areas of the site to it only serves to condone and encourage it imo..i note that in professional comps the use of AI is prohibited, but i'd be interested to know how they enforce it..alas AI is all part of the anti-human agenda being rolled out before our eyes...

Andrea Dietrich
Date: 10/10/2024 6:24:00 AM

so true, Charlotte.

Len
Gasun

Date: 10/10/2024 1:13:00 AM

For me, it's better to write with authenticiy using God's given talent and wisdom to testify His undending love, faithfulness and glory. So no to AI please. Thank you.

Krish
Radhakrishna

Date: 10/10/2024 1:00:00 AM

Incorporate AI in our system to automatically detect AI poems. Like cures like. Second- pin the responsibility on the poets that if they break the rules, they will be removed from poetry soup irrespective of their membership.

Simon
Rogerson

Date: 10/10/2024 12:50:00 AM

This is what we are faced with! Machine: the Final Chapter Computer Bits, bytes, ones, zeros So Charles and Ada conceive - IT’s Pandora’s box Robot Man and beast replaced Same task over and over - Objective carnage AI Boolean bible Artificial ignorance - Logical ending Evolutionary finale – Armageddon! This Haiku set was published in PS: It's Still Poetry

Arlo
Parker

Date: 10/10/2024 12:32:00 AM

Who exactly is getting hurt in this situation? Not the AI poster's. Zero tolerance. PS is for PS amateurs seeking illuminated criticism and acceptance of their emotional work.

Simon Rogerson
Date: 10/10/2024 1:04:00 AM

Totally agree. Human creativity is such an enriching experience which must be cherished and protected.

Simon Rogerson
Date: 10/10/2024 12:43:00 AM

Totally agree. Human creativity is such an enriching experience which must be cherished and protected.

Simon
Rogerson

Date: 10/10/2024 12:11:00 AM

So what can we do about it. I agree that we should not allow AI generated poems to be submitted "under cover" or indeed "accredited". PS is for us as humans to explore our creative sides and share our work with a wonderful inclusive community. The tools to check authenticity will always be limited. AI checking AI is no solution. So it is we as human who must exert our moral compass. Every Souper must explicitly subscribe to the condition of not submitting any AI generated material. If a Souper is unwilling to do that then they should be excluded from our community. Maybe we should suggest a new community is created for AI generators to do their own artificial thing!!!!!

Pivotal Poetry
Date: 10/10/2024 12:28:00 AM

I so whole heartedly agree with you.

Simon
Rogerson

Date: 10/10/2024 12:11:00 AM

The AI bandwagon is seeping into every part of our lives driven by commercial and political imperatives. The quality of AI generated materials are improving all the time. For example take one of your poems and as ChatGPT or Gemini to rewrite it in the style of a famous poet - you will be amazed at the instantaneous outcome!

Tom
Cunningham

Date: 10/9/2024 11:45:00 PM

Like it or not AI is here to stay and will be the future of mankind. I've heard of it being used in Australia where medical researchers would spend months scanning data in their research to find answers, AI performed the same task in minutes. But to use it create a poem is a big no no from me and those using it are cheating. One thing that concerns me is the reliability of software to determine whether or not it is AI generated. I've heard of poets running some of their work through this software and saying it was likely 100 % AI generated or part AI. To rely on these unreliable checkers to pass judgement on an honest poet would be totally wrong in my book. Until there is a robust checker in place we can only rely on poets being honest in what they submit.

Tom Woody
Date: 10/10/2024 10:02:00 AM

Interesting. So in essence what you are suggesting is it will be passable if a person enters say, two AI poems in contests, as long as he/she enters eight human poems in others? I'm sorry, but this just gets more confusing all the time

Andrea Dietrich
Date: 10/10/2024 9:28:00 AM

Easy. The person passes. I'd say if more than half are considered human or only a low possibility of AI, that person is safe.

Tom Woody
Date: 10/10/2024 7:04:00 AM

What is considered a really "good checker" Andrea? It has already been widely established that there are none that can be fully relied on (see my comment to Brian below). And let's say that you check ten poems, two come back 100% AI, five come back 25% and the rest 100% human? What then? Or what if another checker finds altogether different ratios? Until a truly reliable AI checker is developed then this approach will remain problematic. I'm not arguing with you. Maybe your solution is the best one available. But it will come with pain. Guaranteed

Andrea Dietrich
Date: 10/10/2024 6:27:00 AM

This is why I propose running five to ten of a poet's poems through a really good checker so that we can truly know if the poet is using AI.

Tom Woody
Date: 10/10/2024 5:00:00 AM

I couldn't agree more Tom. I don't like AI intrusion either. But the margin for error in accusing someone at this time is too great.

Pivotal Poetry
Date: 10/10/2024 12:35:00 AM

My thoughts exactly, Bones will be rattling, dust will be stirring. AI has no place in Poetry and should not be allowed in this community.

Constance
La France

Date: 10/9/2024 10:44:00 PM

TPS, the great poets of the past must be turning in their graves at what is happening to poetry in this day and age, sorry Shakespeare and others greats, so it is no surprise that I am for banning all 90%- 100% AI poems and poets. No warning, no second chance, cheating is cheating. AI has an important place in science, medicine, research, crime investigation, etc but has NO place in poetry, its fraud to claim as their own. The day we cannot tell AI poems from real poems is the day my pen will no longer ever bleed another word

Suzette Richards
Date: 10/10/2024 11:49:00 PM

lol ... Shakespeare was a plagiarist of the first degree ...

Andrea Dietrich
Date: 10/10/2024 6:27:00 AM

Thanks for doing this, Constance.

Suzette Richards
Date: 10/9/2024 11:37:00 PM

I find the cancel culture more worrying. What next? Insisting only those with verifiable names and no pseudonyms allowed. Much of the spam and AI-GENERATED material are posted by "fake" named accounts. Just my penny's worth.

Suzette Richards
Date: 10/9/2024 10:56:00 PM

There in lies the rub (to quote Shakespeare), Constance: ,,,, claim it as their own.

thriveni c
mysore

Date: 10/9/2024 10:40:00 PM

Develop software exclusive to poetry soup to detect AI generated work.

Simon Rogerson
Date: 10/10/2024 12:48:00 AM

That will not be possible with the accelerating AI evolution. We will get to the point where AI will create AI and so on ad infinitum.

Gary
Radice

Date: 10/9/2024 9:25:00 PM

Perhaps the responsibility of putting each poem through an AI checker and confirming % of such in the notes section (or wherever) should lie with the individual poet themselves - the poet submitting the poem? The AI checker app used should be the same for all for consistency. Anyone found not being truthful about the AI % could be banned for a time period or kicked off altogether. This may also have the effect of reducing potential for spam. Cheers - Gary

Gary Radice
Date: 10/9/2024 10:54:00 PM

Sorry Chris I'm not clear as to what you mean.

Chris Conn
Date: 10/9/2024 10:26:00 PM

This is a for profit enterprise.

Suzette Richards
Date: 10/9/2024 9:35:00 PM

I concur

Sandra
Haight

Date: 10/9/2024 8:36:00 PM

I agree with all the others who vote to prohibit all AI-generated poems. If some get through and are suspected, I support Andrea's idea (below) of sorting them out to test as proof before warning them- or banning them if they persist.

Andrea Dietrich
Date: 10/9/2024 10:43:00 PM

Thanks, Sandra.

Suzette Richards
Date: 10/9/2024 8:50:00 PM

Sorry, Sandra. My comment jumped space ...

Suzette Richards
Date: 10/9/2024 8:49:00 PM

Hi Beata, Yes it is a gift and since Solomon's songs, embraced for the higher art it is. But, by allowing people to indulge in AI creations for their own enjoyment does not harm - others may choose to read it or not. By removing the stigma and threat, it might encourage honesty. There is no cost effective way of policing the site - it costs a lot of data to only check contest entries. We may perhaps support those poets on here who's work we admire, and less time worrying about what is happening over the fence. I like your statement about writing original poems using a God-given talent - not everyone can do so.

Beata
Agustin

Date: 10/9/2024 8:15:00 PM

I stand for authentic creative human intelligence to propel me in writing poetry. Thus, I vote for "Prohibit all AI generated poems." That's what I exhort my students to do. In our creative writing class, I ask my students to bring with them their heart, soul, spirit and faith... along pen and paper. Since I am with them in their writing schedule, they write with no AI inspiration. I already discussed with them about AI-generated poems, and they agree with me that they rather write their "original" poems from their God-given authentic creative intelligence.

Suzette Richards
Date: 10/10/2024 5:40:00 AM

Hi Beata, Yes, it is a gift and since Solomon's songs, embraced for the higher art it is. But, by allowing people to indulge in AI creations for their own enjoyment does no harm - others may choose to read it or not. By removing the stigma and threat, it might encourage honesty. There is no cost-effective way of policing the site - it costs a lot of data to only check contest entries. We may perhaps support those poets on here who's work we admire, and less time worrying about what is happening over the fence. I like your statement about writing original poems using a God-given talent - but not everyone can do so.

Pivotal Poetry
Date: 10/10/2024 12:36:00 AM

Here Here! well said.

Andrea Dietrich
Date: 10/9/2024 10:42:00 PM

Bravo, Beata

Suzette Richards
Date: 10/9/2024 8:51:00 PM

See my comment under Sandra 's post, please. ;)

Keith D
Trestrail

Date: 10/9/2024 7:49:00 PM

Someone call Elon. He’ll fix it!

Keith D Trestrail
Date: 10/10/2024 3:52:00 AM

Andrea, I’d like to say I’m doing well but that would be a gross exaggeration. May God bless you always.

Keith D Trestrail
Date: 10/10/2024 3:49:00 AM

Chris, he’s one of the smartest people on the planet and probably the most successful but you sound like you know what you’re talking about.

Andrea Dietrich
Date: 10/9/2024 10:41:00 PM

I was addressing Suzette and my comment came up here to yours , Keith. How are you doing these days?

Andrea Dietrich
Date: 10/9/2024 10:40:00 PM

In certain kinds of poetry forms that are not based on pure emotion, I think it can be difficult to spot one that is AI.

Chris Conn
Date: 10/9/2024 10:28:00 PM

There’s no one more artificially intelligent then Elon.

Craig
Cornish

Date: 10/9/2024 7:41:00 PM

TPS, I applaud your honest exploration of emotions on this subject. Yes, artificial "everything" is here to stay, yet it is nothing without all that has already been though and expressed by humans. Build better machines more quickly - build better advances in medical equipment and cures...yet, hear me on this, it can stay even with (at some point) but could never equal or exceed the passion and feelings created between and amongst humans. Yes, Spock was logical and interesting, but not truly warm and that is sad. If you can not cry in your own heart, others will not cry with you - though they may feel pity and empathy that you can't--let's become an example for truth an honesty - our own pen

Tom Woody
Date: 10/10/2024 7:06:00 PM

I grok Spock

Craig Cornish
Date: 10/9/2024 7:49:00 PM

And, to those who honor religion, remember "Thou shalt have no other Gods before me" -- It is the HUMAN heart where passion and love is found - not in a pretending one...

Susan
Ashley

Date: 10/9/2024 6:23:00 PM

I don’t find AI generated poetry attractive in any way, nor do I wish to waste my time reading it. AI poetry should not be allowed on a creative poetry site as this, and should be discouraged in every way by administration and creative poets alike. We shouldn’t just accept AI poetry being forced upon us just because AI’s ability to become undetectable is “inevitable”.. for every action there is a reaction; as AI’s ability to spit out recycled poetry advances, the detection tools used to identify fake poetry will advance too. In the meantime, administration and creative poets, we must link arms against letting AI generated poetry saturate our poetry site. Human written poetry only! P.S. sorry, I offer no solutions, but rather, where I stand on this issue.

Jcb Brul
Date: 10/10/2024 9:03:00 AM

I couldn't agree more!

Tom Woody
Date: 10/10/2024 5:03:00 AM

I think most agree Susan, but like you readily admit, no easy solutions

Pivotal Poetry
Date: 10/10/2024 12:40:00 AM

I'm with you, totally agree.

Di11y Da11y
Date: 10/9/2024 10:54:00 PM

Agreed wholeheartedly

Andrea Dietrich
Date: 10/9/2024 10:37:00 PM

Right on!

Ricky Muse
Date: 10/9/2024 7:51:00 PM

I agree Susan. Well said.

Craig Cornish
Date: 10/9/2024 7:27:00 PM

Bravo - yes, we must

Unseeking Seeker
Date: 10/9/2024 7:07:00 PM

Agree. I feel likewise

Richard D
Seal

Date: 10/9/2024 5:38:00 PM

Though I’m adamantly against the use of AI, I can see no way of keeping it out of the soup. For my part I’m only reading those I trust, at least for the time being. They will know who they are when I comment. In some ways this may combat the use of AI and build a better community in the future with more communication. Doesn't help the contests but will be down to the sponsors.

Di11y Da11y
Date: 10/9/2024 10:55:00 PM

Deterring it at least seems appropriate

Andrea Dietrich
Date: 10/9/2024 10:36:00 PM

I am trying to do that too, Richard.

Richard D Seal
Date: 10/9/2024 6:19:00 PM

There’s no stopping it Hilda, I’m hoping you won’t leave. Doesn’t soup need the honest ones among us now more than ever?

Hilda Greenhough
Date: 10/9/2024 6:09:00 PM

If AI writes poetry, I want my $99 back

Andrea
Dietrich

Date: 10/9/2024 5:27:00 PM

People are afraid of being banned if a poem tests as AI generated. Here is what you could do. When a number of poets see a poet using A I consistently, an investigation could be launched to verify the issue. A test could be made of 5 to 10 of that poet's poems. If all look like 90 to 100 percent AI, he can be suspended for a few months , when ban is lifted and people notice the same behavior continuing, then he can be permanently banned. A long time ago we got a plagiarist ousted because several of us saw he was submitting quotes of famous people and attributing them to his own words of wisdom. He was suspended and came back . Then he repeated his practice all over again. I have not seen hide nor hair of him since.

Suzette Richards
Date: 10/9/2024 11:13:00 PM

I am with you insofar as I don't care. I trust that sponsors know their own minds and can select poetry that appeals to them. That is why I stick to reading contest winners list but don't often comment, especially when my data is low.

Andrea Dietrich
Date: 10/9/2024 10:33:00 PM

Honestly, Suzette, I do not know how to tell and I don't want to be made to check out all the contest entries in my contests. The only reason I am sure about one guy in particular is because his grammar and everything else drastically improved as if overnight. I don't care if people want to stupidly post AI poems just as long as they are not entered in contests with people who didn't cheat.

Suzette Richards
Date: 10/9/2024 8:09:00 PM

On the application form, it could clearly state no AI poetry allowed. Those spamming the site with AI could be removed. One does not need a checker to identify AI they stand out above human submissions. Checking poems written by the same poet prior AI and current material is a very good measure of authenticity.

Craig Cornish
Date: 10/9/2024 7:26:00 PM

Agreed totally Andrea

Tom Woody
Date: 10/9/2024 5:36:00 PM

I like Brandy's idea. If AI poems could be prevented from ever entering the site to begin with, all issues solved. But yours seems reasonable too as long as no public accusations and admins do the investigating not members. I do worry about people getting hurt though. Already two contest winners have been publicly accused by sponsors. I personally ran one of the winning poems through three AI checkers and all came back 100% human

Brandy
Nicole

Date: 10/9/2024 4:53:00 PM

This isn't peanut butter and jelly. AI and a poetry site just don't go together. Using AI to create poems outside this site, to share and have fun family and friends. That's one thing. Here, it just doesn't belong.

Brandy Nicole
Date: 10/9/2024 7:18:00 PM

" Web developers are responsible for adding HTML code to websites. "

Brandy Nicole
Date: 10/9/2024 7:17:00 PM

By adding a ``Disallow'' directive in your website's robots. txt file, using the ``noindex'' meta tag in your website's HTML code, or using CAPTCHA or reCAPTCHA to block bots, you can prevent ChatGPT from crawling and using your website content.

Team Poetrysoup
Date: 10/9/2024 6:54:00 PM

Bots aren't creating AI poems, people are using AI software to create poems.

Tom Woody
Date: 10/9/2024 6:48:00 PM

I don't know much about tech but doesn't captcha prevent bots? Folks using AI are simply pasting text that has already been AI generated. I'm not sure your idea would fit. No easy solutions for sure

Tom Woody
Date: 10/9/2024 5:21:00 PM

Worth checking into admins?

Brandy Nicole
Date: 10/9/2024 5:19:00 PM

I have no idea if it works, but, it's a thought.

Brandy Nicole
Date: 10/9/2024 5:18:00 PM

Just looking and came across this: Earlier this year, Cloudflare debuted a tool that allowed customers to block all known AI bots in one go; this new version offers more control to pick and choose which bots they want to block or permit. Sep 23, 2024

Tom Woody
Date: 10/9/2024 5:02:00 PM

So how do you recommend eliminating it? Just curious. For the record (again) I'm not for it either. Maybe you have an idea for getting rid of it that doesn't involve potentially hurting innocent people

Sandra
Doolan

Date: 10/9/2024 4:44:00 PM

I think AI generated poems should not be allowed. They should be discouraged and anyone found to be writing AI generated poetry should be banned from poetry soup for life. This is only inevitable if we allow it to be. We need to do our best to fight this. Regards Sandra Doolan

Janis
Medders Tobechi

Date: 10/9/2024 4:23:00 PM

what is a URL. I am to unteched to find anything generated by AI. I would like to see a sample of an AI generated poem. Can they write better than____? Where can they be found? Is there someplace named that?

Suzette Richards
Date: 10/9/2024 8:14:00 PM

For samples of AI generated poems, see my latest blog posted a few days ago. :)

Franci
Hoffman

Date: 10/9/2024 3:24:00 PM

I am not a fan of AI poetry. I prefer an outright ban, especially for poetry contests. With that said, I don't think it's possible to consistently determine if a poem is Ai. Why bother writing poetry if your work doesn't express your own feelings.

Jcb Brul
Date: 10/10/2024 9:02:00 AM

Exactly!

Andrea Dietrich
Date: 10/9/2024 5:10:00 PM

Yes. Same for me

Jan Allison
Date: 10/9/2024 3:32:00 PM

well said Franci! i agree wholehearted with your thoughts

Team
Poetrysoup

Date: 10/9/2024 2:59:00 PM

It looks like there is a pretty clear consensus among Soupers so far.

Jan Allison
Date: 10/9/2024 3:23:00 PM

thanks for the reply and reassurance that the contest formats won't change TS, the blog instigating suggested changes to the site has upset many people

Tom Woody
Date: 10/9/2024 3:22:00 PM

Hmmm... I'm counting 6 for accommodation. In the end, it's your site, do what you want. I've made it clear that it doesn't matter to me one way or the other since what others do or don't do will NEVER impact what I choose to do.

Tania Kitchin
Date: 10/9/2024 3:19:00 PM

I agree with Jan. Contests encourage more writing, ideas and brings poets together. If contests are too regulated or eliminated then PS may lose members.

Team Poetrysoup
Date: 10/9/2024 3:18:00 PM

@Jan, ideas should not upset anyone. However, implementing ideas may. We have no plans on changing the contests.

Jan Allison
Date: 10/9/2024 3:15:00 PM

I appreciate it is off the AI topic, but the issue with the new ideas on contests is that is upsetting many on the site. In my opinion, 'If it ain't broken then why try to fix it'

Team Poetrysoup
Date: 10/9/2024 3:15:00 PM

@Tom, incorrect. It's 11-4 so far.

Tom Woody
Date: 10/9/2024 3:03:00 PM

Actually, if you read the comments carefully, roughly half have suggested some form of regulated accommodation and the other half an outright ban

Ray
Zottola

Date: 10/9/2024 2:55:00 PM

Voice ID may be one way. First the old fashioned way is to call and verify. Next, use AI to detect AI. That should improve over time as well.

Jan
Allison

Date: 10/9/2024 2:40:00 PM

It's a poetry site, we should be posting poems we have written ourselves and not using a bot to do it for us. You send conflicting messages by creating a book using AI - it is NOT a good message to send out to the members of Poetry soup let alone sharing it to the outside world. it makes a mockery of the site and I am amazed you even thought about publishing it in the future.

Team Poetrysoup
Date: 10/9/2024 3:20:00 PM

@Jan, at the time it was just exploration of something new. That's all.

Jan Allison
Date: 10/9/2024 3:01:00 PM

No actually I was only made aware of it recently by another souper in a blog, and I have not been the only one to comment about it. You never answered my question WHY you even thought of going down this route

Team Poetrysoup
Date: 10/9/2024 2:53:00 PM

We published it in the past. :-) But you are making more people aware of it.

My Past Blog Posts


The New PoetrySoup Anthology is HERE!!! Date Posted: 11/24/2024 2:37:00 PM
Anthology Selection Process Update! Date Posted: 11/15/2024 7:04:00 AM
AI Poems and PoetrySoup. What are Your Thoughts on How Our Community Should Approach AI Poems? Date Posted: 10/9/2024 12:57:00 PM
AI Generated Poem Detection Date Posted: 10/2/2024 9:28:00 AM
Calling All Poets: Join PoetrySoup's Quest to Create the Most Visually Stunning and Uplifting Poetry Anthology Ever Date Posted: 8/6/2024 11:38:00 AM
Please check your Email SPAM Folder Soupers Date Posted: 6/19/2024 5:50:00 PM
It's almost time for another inspiring PoetrySoup poetry book! Date Posted: 5/23/2024 4:11:00 PM
It's PoetrySoup's 19th Anniversary! Date Posted: 2/1/2024 6:09:00 PM
PoetrySoup's Latest Anthology is Here: Reflections on the Important Things Date Posted: 11/16/2023 9:52:00 AM
Anthology Selection Process Update! Date Posted: 11/6/2023 9:23:00 AM
To All PoetrySoup Members. Censorship is a Slippery Slope. But Hate Speech... Date Posted: 10/31/2023 2:40:00 PM
Whew! All anthology entries have been read... Date Posted: 10/23/2023 12:32:00 PM
UPDATE: Our Upcoming Anthology Date Posted: 10/2/2023 5:59:00 AM
Extending the anthology submission deadline... Date Posted: 9/6/2023 1:11:00 PM
Now accepting poems for our next anthology Date Posted: 5/2/2023 8:22:00 AM
New PoetrySoup Anthology or Book. What are Your Thoughts? Date Posted: 2/13/2023 11:55:00 AM
Choose the poems you want featured on the PoetrySoup home page! Date Posted: 10/2/2022 7:54:00 AM
PoetrySoup email services are down Date Posted: 9/17/2022 7:47:00 AM
Remembering Our Dear Connie Marcum Wong Date Posted: 9/14/2022 11:14:00 AM
Judith Angell Meyer Date Posted: 7/29/2022 8:42:00 AM
PS: It's Still Poetry - An Anthology of Contemporary Poetry from Around the World - The Anthology is Here! Date Posted: 1/2/2022 1:11:00 PM
Anthology Update...Waiting for Amazon.com Legal Date Posted: 1/2/2022 10:48:00 AM
PoetrySoup is Very Close to Publishing Our Anthology Date Posted: 12/24/2021 11:12:00 AM
RULES: Poem Content and Personal Attacks, Battles, or Cyberbullying and Harassment Date Posted: 12/20/2021 1:48:00 PM
PoetrySoup Anthology Update Date Posted: 12/14/2021 2:43:00 PM

My Recent Poems

Date Posted	PoemTitle	Form	Categories
1/6/2025	Herbbhusn	Abecedarian	age,
1/28/2024	test	Free verse	america,
12/16/2020	Email Envy	Free verse	anger,angst,
10/21/2020	A Good Haiku	Haiku	funny,
7/21/2020	Fgadfgads	Chant Royal	aubade,
5/21/2020	Qweeebler Quip Num - a Vogon Poem	Vogon Poetry	science fiction,
11/13/2019	Nshdudu	Ballade	10th grade,
8/26/2019	Fjfkfmq	Carpe Diem	angst,
6/18/2019	Test	Chant Royal	absence,
4/14/2019	Fgadfgbbb!?	Cinquain	blue,boxing day ,
4/24/2018	School	Free verse	2nd grade,3rd grade,4th g
4/2/2018	Chunari	Free verse	red,
1/10/2018	Vogon Love	Vogon Poetry	i love you,love,
3/6/2017	Trumpty Dumpty	Rhyme	funny,political,
1/22/2016	Gfadga Grup	Haibun	art,
5/22/2015	Soup's Test	Blank verse	lost,
10/23/2014	Spicy Spicy	Dramatic Verse	food,

My Photos

Fav Poems

PoemTitle	Form	Categories
Hard Hat Heroes	Ballad	people,song-daughter,fire
A Weakness Among Us	Senryu	life,
The Enmity	Light Verse	feelings,history,identity
Workshop Poem Life With Its Obstacles	Alliteration	inspiration,inspirational
- Valentine Jewel -	Couplet	beautiful,boyfriend,girlf
Cupid Had An Arrow	Rhyme	beautiful,happiness,imagi
Comes, Spring	Diminished Hexaverse	appreciation,fun,imagery,
Fair Game	Political Verse	america,anger,betrayal,bi

Fav Poets

Poet	Country
Carol Sunshine Brown	United States	Read
Marycile Beer	United States	Read
Andrea Dietrich	United States	Read
Debbie Guzzi	United States	Read
Carolyn Devonshire	United States	Read
Demetrios Trifiatis	Greece	Read
Darren White	Netherlands	Read
Etienne Lariviere	France	Read
Davin Payne	United States	Read
Team Poetrysoup	United States	Read